What should I expect if I swap in coaxial speakers into the JBL front door?

[Regius]

I don't want to disrupt the factory system too much or spend too much energy. I have the JBL system and I already did the rear door deadening, and replaced the rear door speakers with a pair of Infinity ref coaxial (the JBL was coaxial to begin with). Now, getting ready to do the front door, but the front have component speakers. Crutchfield recommended the Rockford Fosgate P1 punch (v2), based on what I wanted. They say with the built-in tweeters on these coaxial speakers, I will expect to hear a change of sound staging. For me, a mere change of location of the instruments is fine, there is still a "sound stage" afterall, only different now. What would be the worst that could happen if I may ask? Also, they say if I buy component system, whether or not I care to replace my A pillar tweets/dash corner tweeters, I may need an amp, so the JBL amp is not enough for aftermarket component system?

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[gmalkmus]

Not gonna notice much change. If anything, it’ll be worse. Save for a full system upgrade rather than changing individual things hoping for a difference.

 

[aquaman67]

Have you tried putting a small piece of electrical tape on the three middle contacts on the removable center speaker?

The outer contacts are the positive and negative to keep the battery in the speaker charged in case you want to use it and it’s not good for the battery to drain and stay discharged for a long time. You don’t want to ruin the speaker just take it out of the sound equation.

It’s reversible. Just remove that little piece of tape.

I prefer the sound system with the center speaker quite.

 

[Regius]

Have you tried putting a small piece of electrical tape on the three middle contacts on the removable center speaker?

The outer contacts are the positive and negative to keep the battery in the speaker charged in case you want to use it and it’s not good for the battery to drain and stay discharged for a long time. You don’t want to ruin the speaker just take it out of the sound equation.

It’s reversible. Just remove that little piece of tape.

I prefer the sound system with the center speaker quite.

Thanks for the tip! I wasn't quite thinking how the Rockford coaxial would interfere with this removable center speaker, I was thinking about the two A pillar tweeters, but your point is taken.

 

[The Dude]

As much as I love Crutchfield, sometimes…..

To answer your question, there WILL be a change in sound, only because the speaker changed. There are crossovers on all the speakers, which would negate the tweeter from playing in the front door.

 

[Regius]

As much as I love Crutchfield, sometimes…..

To answer your question, there WILL be a change in sound, only because the speaker changed. There are crossovers on all the speakers, which would negate the tweeter from playing in the front door.

If I opt for the route of swapping in a component system, what brand and model of component speakers would work as plug and play? my audio shop only carries high end brands like Audison and they have a model that's bolt on, about $400, I don't mind spending if it's that good, just wanted to hear from actual Tacoma owners.

 

[gmalkmus]

If I opt for the route of swapping in a component system, what brand and model of component speakers would work as plug and play? my audio shop only carries high end brands like Audison and they have a model that's bolt on, about $400, I don't mind spending if it's that good, just wanted to hear from actual Tacoma owners.

The problem is you are going to need more than just a component speaker set to get the sound you’re looking for. Swapping in components without changing the amp or signal processing is not going to sound better - it will likely sound worse. The stock JBL system is designed to sound best with the speakers it came with. Swapping in new ones without correcting the signal being sent to the speakers will result in a less than optimized sound.

At minimum, you will need a DSP amplifier to both correct the signal being sent from the headunit and to send enough power to aftermarket components.

 

[The Dude]

Agree 100% with @gmalkmus , just changing speakers is a band-aid on a gaping wound. You “might” like the sound, or you could very well not. I’m gong to drop a little science on you, sorry.

The JBL system in the truck is 2.3 Ω, and most aftermarket speakers are 4 Ω. So, you’d need to adjust the volume up about 30% more than usual now to achieve the same perceived volume. That’s problem one. The other is that Toyota spec’d the speakers in there now for that amplifier. Tone, peaks, filters, all of it taken into account by whomever provides the speakers. Changing just the speakers “could” go either way.

If you decide to swap out speakers anyways, by all means. I recommend for a mellow, easy sound….Morel. For a more “exciting”, in your face sound….Focal. But for goodness sake, find a different shop. ANY speaker can be made plug-n-play with the right speaker adapters. Simple 2-wire plugs that just plug in to the factory plug and have bare wire to connect to any speaker. And, if you have the JBL system, like you said, you have a 3-way system, not the 2-way Crutchfield told you.

*edit*. I realized after typing, you mentioned that $400 was kinda pricey, and here I go recommending $1000+ sets, sorry. For an entry level try the Kicker KSS369, they’re pretty good for a budget set.
https://www.crutchfield.com/p_20651KSS39/Kicker-KSS369.html?tp=106

 

[Regius]

Agree 100% with @gmalkmus , just changing speakers is a band-aid on a gaping wound. You “might” like the sound, or you could very well not. I’m gong to drop a little science on you, sorry.

The JBL system in the truck is 2.3 Ω, and most aftermarket speakers are 4 Ω. So, you’d need to adjust the volume up about 30% more than usual now to achieve the same perceived volume. That’s problem one. The other is that Toyota spec’d the speakers in there now for that amplifier. Tone, peaks, filters, all of it taken into account by whomever provides the speakers. Changing just the speakers “could” go either way.

If you decide to swap out speakers anyways, by all means. I recommend for a mellow, easy sound….Morel. For a more “exciting”, in your face sound….Focal. But for goodness sake, find a different shop. ANY speaker can be made plug-n-play with the right speaker adapters. Simple 2-wire plugs that just plug in to the factory plug and have bare wire to connect to any speaker. And, if you have the JBL system, like you said, you have a 3-way system, not the 2-way Crutchfield told you.

*edit*. I realized after typing, you mentioned that $400 was kinda pricey, and here I go recommending $1000+ sets, sorry. For an entry level try the Kicker KSS369, they’re pretty good for a budget set.
https://www.crutchfield.com/p_20651KSS39/Kicker-KSS369.html?tp=106

So, first about the impedence, great point, thanks. Crutchfield does carry some 2ohm components and they are in the $$$$ range, but I may just invest in those if everything else works out. Question is, if Toyota is 2.3ohm, could 2ohm damage the JBL amp. I doubt there are aftermarket component that are exactly 2.3. Maybe go for 3ohms?

Anyway, in terms of the JBL amp tuned to work with the JBL door speakers and A pillar tweeter, I may live with the possibility that the aftermarket speakers may sound worse, but in fact they may just sound "different" and I'd be ok with it.

Also, why are you suggesting find a different shop?

 

[The Dude]

So, first about the impedence, great point, thanks. Crutchfield does carry some 2ohm components and they are in the $$$$ range, but I may just invest in those if everything else works out. Question is, if Toyota is 2.3ohm, could 2ohm damage the JBL amp. I doubt there are aftermarket component that are exactly 2.3. Maybe go for 3ohms?

Anyway, in terms of the JBL amp tuned to work with the JBL door speakers and A pillar tweeter, I may live with the possibility that the aftermarket speakers may sound worse, but in fact they may just sound "different" and I'd be ok with it.

Also, why are you suggesting find a different shop?

Okay, 3-parter.

1 - Nope, 2 Ω would be fine. 2.3 is nominal, but loud/heavy passages, impedance fluctuates. You’d be fine with 2 Ω.
2 - If you can live with a change in sound, and there WILL be one, I will NEVER discourage anyone from a positive change. I just hate the snake-oil companies promising the world (long story for another time.) Speaker companies just say “we make things that make sound, it’s up to you to decide if you like it.”
3 - If your shop a) doesn’t have any budget choices b) don’t inform you it’s a 3-way setup, and c) don’t tell you how easy it is to make any speaker p-n-p, hard pass. They’re more interested in making money off of you than helping you make a dream system. I’ve seen horror installs from shops like that, corners cut, no proper techniques followed, and jacked up factory wiring, where, if you wanted to go back to factory, ie. trade-in, all your gear has to go with the truck, because you can’t go back to stock.

Question on the shop, did they have pictures of installs they’ve done, more than one or two, that show good technique? Food for thought.

 

[Regius]

Okay, 3-parter.

Thanks!

Before commenting on my perception of my shop, quick question as I am still within the 60 day return period LOL.

I didn't mention that for the rear doors, I have previously swapped in a pair of Crutchfield's Inifity REF607FSL, 4ohms, two way co-ax. The original JBL rear doors are also two way co-ax.

Now, I honestly do not remember what the original sounded like, I didn't put much thought into it, all I can say is after the install, the perceived volumn did not change and the overall emotional impact of most of the music I listen to is very good, perhaps slightly better. However, scientifically, it might have been worse, but since I don't remember how it sounded before, and it might not be much worse, therefore i can't perceive it. Also, in terms of placebo effect, I had very good and perceivably positive experiences with Infinity co-ax speakers on 4runners without the JBL, so, I trust that these Infinity products are generally pretty good. I'd prefer not have to take off the Inifinity Ref607, BUT, if you have any warning/negative comment, please speak up and I still have time to return them to Crutchfield (not sure I'd actually do it, they only cost $109 and I'm sure I will pay for a restock fee).

Now about my shop. Well, I never got the impression they want to just make money, not sure how you got the impression from my writing. They did not push the Audison $400 unit on me, they are always very willing to install my own speakers unless they have a reason not to. They installed all four doors for my non-JBL 4runner, put sound deadening, and installed the JBL rear door, until they feel strongly the 3-way co-ax Rockford Fosgate for the JBL front door is not a good choice.

Also, judging from how they installed sound deadening, I feel they do care a lot about their work. For the record, they position themselves as a speaker shop and not a sound deadening specialist, they don't stock a lot of Dynamatt or whatever other brand, I always bring my own. I brought some rolls of expensive Resonix decoupler foam (3mm), and some Resonix deadening butyl stuff, they felt the 3mm foam is pointless even though I kept saying I just want to slap them on and not waste them. Also, they seem to care much about the positioning of the butyle deadening material, instead of just randomly slap them on to cover all the surfaces. Culturally speaking, they are Korean immigrants and I know Koreans can be anal retentive and subborn, but that's another topic, my point is they may take too much pride in their work than I require (me: " please, just do it!", them: "NO! it does not look right!"). Also, they always give me like $25 or $50 off because I am a return customer.

I have not had them do complex work, but I have no doubt they know how to properly plug wires into the right places. I live near Greenwich CT and they frequently work on semi-vintage Porsche and Mercedez.

Anyway, one thing I would not tolerate is reduction of volume, so, the impedence detail was very helpful. I don't want to lose clarity, I want to improve bass, other than that I'm not looking to make the truck sound like a Volvo system or E-class.

 

[The Dude]

Infinity’s are fine speakers, well regarded in car audio communities. They have a hard dome or metal tweeeter, so you get a more “exciting” or “engaging” sound. If you like them, awesome, I’m very happy for you. You may want to consider the JBL “Club” line, as it comes in 3 Ω impedance, giving back a little volume after changing speakers.

As for the shop, my apologies. I made an assumption based on what I’ve personally experienced, and I didn’t read correctly how you wrote about them. I’ve personally visited over 20 shops in my town, and there’s 2 that I would allow touch my truck. I transferred my bias onto what I thought everywhere must be like. I hope you can accept my apologies. If you are happy with who works on your truck…

The important part is really the science part. You said you’ve not noticed a difference in volume replacing the rears, but can’t recall the originals. Honestly, IMO the rears don’t really do much anyways, in these trucks. The output is fairly neutered compared to the fronts. Just fade completely to the rear, to see what I mean.

Again, I didn’t mean to insult or offend, I just have such a high standard for my installs, I want the best for everyone. Not saying I’m the best, I just strive to be better than some shops.

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