Alignment question after 2 inch lift

[kc310]

Hello everyone,

Just wanted to ask a quick question for those of us with lifted Tacomas regarding alignment specs. I’m not sure if I’m being gaslighted or not but the place that did my alignment is telling me .9 per side of toe is correct for a 2 inch lift on my 4th gen Tacoma. I’m getting scrubbing and squealing during turns even at parking lot speeds. They’re saying it drives straight so the alignment is good. Can anyone help confirm?

Thank you,
K

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[gofastdan]

That can't possibly be good. That much toe will destroy your tires. It might drive straight but that's simply because it's the same on both sides, not because it's right. If anything, toe should be as close to 0 as possible. The original shop that did my alignment after my lift put toe at .10 and within 15k I could see pretty severe cupping on the tires. I took it to a better shop and we set it closer to zero and it's much better now (although these tires are still not going to last long due to the length of time they were scrubbing).

The camber also seems a bit extreme to me but maybe that's ok. Not sure why Toyota specs that much positive camber....

Here are my current settings. Ignore that it says it's a '20-'23. That's just b/c the shop's database hadn't been updated w/'24 specs yet.

 

[kc310]

That can't possibly be good. That much toe will destroy your tires. It might drive straight but that's simply because it's the same on both sides, not because it's right. If anything, toe should be as close to 0 as possible. The original shop that did my alignment after my lift put toe at .10 and within 15k I could see pretty severe cupping on the tires. I took it to a better shop and we set it closer to zero and it's much better now (although these tires are still not going to last long due to the length of time they were scrubbing).

The camber also seems a bit extreme to me but maybe that's ok. Not sure why Toyota specs that much positive camber....

Here are my current settings. Ignore that it says it's a '20-'23. That's just b/c the shop's database hadn't been updated w/'24 specs yet.

 

[kc310]

Hey thanks for your reply. Exactly what I was afraid of. How does a reputable shop get it so wrong? I am getting so much pushback from them and they even said if they re do my alignment and it doesn’t drive straight it’s not on them. I have an appointment on Thursday, I am hesitant to bring it back to them since they’re even trying to argue that .9 per side if acceptable. I think I’ll take it to Toyota instead, and leave this shop a bad review.

 

[gofastdan]

This is a good thread to read through. Even the most extreme cases don't have the toe they set your's at!

 

[kc310]

This is a good thread to read through. Even the most extreme cases don't have the toe they set your's at!

I got fed up so I left a bad review on their Yelp, and got a reply from the store manager. He was quick in his actions to make things right. I am receiving a refund for the alignment, and they’re going to set the toe to whatever spec I want. I will be using the spec you have on yours, I think .05 will be ok. Your reply was gold, thank you.

 

[Appaloosa2]

I have a 25 Sport and put Alldogs front springs in and took mine to the Toyota dealership and here are my specs. They measured the lift and went with option C on the specs.

 

[kc310]

I have a 25 Sport and put Alldogs front springs in and took mine to the Toyota dealership and here are my specs. They measured the lift and went with option C on the specs.

Gotcha, yours per side are a bit higher than what’s been recommended by others. Not as high as mine but still about 4 times higher. Any idea why that is? I’m wondering what a good toe what be for my truck when I bring it in tomorrow.

Edit: my mistake is the top one or bottom one the specs they put you at?

 

[gofastdan]

Green (current) are the new specs. That seems very high. I don't trust the dealer any more than I do the generic tire shop with 19yo technicians. In 10k you'll know if that's ok or not, all I know is I destroyed a nice set of KO3's using toe far less than that.... ;o)

To be fair and non-flippant, the more I read about it, the more I wonder where all the Toyota specs are coming from. If you look at KC310's first post, it does say the "spec" is .82 to .97. Some kid just went right in the middle w/o even wondering if that made sense or not. If you look at Appaloosa2's image he had done at the dealer, it says the spec is .34 to .49 so, again, they just slapped in the middle and called it a day. Those are very different numbers but I don't trust either of them. If you talk to any real tire guy he'll tell you the ultimate goal is to have toe at 0 and have the tires pointed perfectly straight. Even a mass tire dealer like Les Schwab says that.

I trust the gentleman who I had fix my alignment. His comment is that in a perfect world it would be zero but a perfectly straight front end tends to wander in truck grooves and whatnot, and people don't like that, so you can introduce some toe to reduce the tendency to track. That made sense to me. Ultimately you have to be comfortable with how the truck drives.

Again, in my case, I told him to set it like he would on his truck, so that's what he did and then he gave me 30 days to drive it and told me that if I didn't like the way it handled in that time to bring back and he'd change it. That's the guy I want working on my truck!

 

[kc310]

Gotcha, yours per side are a bit higher than what’s been recommended by others. Not as high as mine but still about 4 times higher. Any idea why that is? I’m wondering what a good toe what be for my truck when I bring it in tomorrow.

Green (current) are the new specs. That seems very high. I don't trust the dealer any more than I do the generic tire shop with 19yo technicians. In 10k you'll know if that's ok or not, all I know is I destroyed a nice set of KO3's using toe far less than that.... ;o)

To be fair and non-flippant, the more I read about it, the more I wonder where all the Toyota specs are coming from. If you look at KC310's first post, it does say the "spec" is .82 to .97. Some kid just went right in the middle w/o even wondering if that made sense or not. If you look at Appaloosa2's image he had done at the dealer, it says the spec is .34 to .49 so, again, they just slapped in the middle and called it a day. Those are very different numbers but I don't trust either of them. If you talk to any real tire guy he'll tell you the ultimate goal is to have toe at 0 and have the tires pointed perfectly straight. Even a mass tire dealer like Les Schwab says that.

I trust the gentleman who I had fix my alignment. His comment is that in a perfect world it would be zero but a perfectly straight front end tends to wander in truck grooves and whatnot, and people don't like that, so you can introduce some toe to reduce the tendency to track. That made sense to me. Ultimately you have to be comfortable with how the truck drives.

Again, in my case, I told him to set it like he would on his truck, so that's what he did and then he gave me 30 days to drive it and told me that if I didn't like the way it handled in that time to bring back and he'd change it. That's the guy I want working on my truck!

Agreed, you are very fortunate to have someone to be able to rely on for alignments. Very rare thing apparently. You wouldn’t happen to know anyone that can help in Southern California would you? Haha

 

[gofastdan]

Ha! Unfortunately, no. Others on the forum very well might though.

 

[kc310]

Ha! Unfortunately, no. Others on the forum very well might though.

Alright so I took my truck to the shop today. I gave them the exact specs I wanted(ones you and others have provided). It’s still there just got off the phone they’re saying it’s not achievable. According to their machine(Hunter) .9 is perfectly straight. Which I know for a fact is objectively wrong, 0 degrees is perfectly straight and that’s not even debatable. But they’re saying on their machine .9 is perfectly straight and that anything below will be pointing outward. I don’t know what the hell is going on I’m tempted to say something is wrong with their machine maybe it’s a proprietary thing where this brand of alignment rack uses different metric or something which would be outrageous but I am all out of ideas. .9 is what they’re going to set it at and I’m going to take it to another shop for them to look at


Edit: I went to the shop as they were working on my truck and asked to see the screen. .9 was in the green. I told them to set it to .11 total toe so .05 and .06 each side and to leave it at that. The store manager was present and is questioning why Hunter machines has the spec at .9 toe. I think the .9 toe per side is specifically a mistake by Hunter machines and that’s why we’re seeing people with that spec. So yeah .9 is NOT perfectly straight according to their machine, .9 is toed inward, he was just saying it was perfectly straight because it was showing green. But that’s not even debatable we know that is objectively wrong. The guy also tried to argue that positive camber was toe outward. So yeah take what he says with a grain of salt(good guy just doesn’t really know what he’s saying). All in all, the store manager was quick to rectify the situation, they accommodated my specific spec requests, and had good attitudes about the whole thing(except the salesman I dealt with). They made a mistake but they’re just going off the machine and what it tells them, but it’s just facts that .9 toe is outrageous and never any reason to set such a spec.

 

[gofastdan]

Welp, who knows. I guess anything is possible, but using that logic then per their specs the values of .82 to .97 are allowable. If .90 is perfectly straight, then .82 would be negative toe (pointed out) and still within spec, which no one would ever want in a vehicle driven on the street. So, yeah, whole thing seems very odd imho!

 

[828findadventure]

Got the alignment at the dealer after lifting our other vehicle a 25 4runner. I went to them because they had installed several Westcott lifts already and the vehicle was under warranty.

 

[kc310]

Got the alignment at the dealer after lifting our other vehicle a 25 4runner. I went to them because they had installed several Westcott lifts already and the vehicle was under warranty.

Makes sense! Do you have a pic your spec sheet you can share?

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