Oil Change Question?

[CEtaco]

I see a lot of people discussing the importance of changing the engine oil at 5000 mile intervals instead of 10k as suggested in the manual. I do understand and agree it can only help with longevity. However, is changing the filter really necessary every 5k if they are rated for 10k. Sure, the optimal thing is to change both the oil and the filter, but since the filters are rated at 10k, why not just change the oil and re-use the filter. It’s still fresh oil which can only help the engines longevity. What am I missing here?

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[Pappy]

I guess replacing the filter with oil changes is tradition. That said, since the N1 filter is a joke, I would change it. If you want to run the N3 (aka 10010) or F1 filters, which are larger, then maybe. But, since the filter is only $5-$6 at the dealer (depending on where you shop), it's cheap insurance.

 

[CEtaco]

I guess replacing the filter with oil changes is tradition. That said, since the N1 filter is a joke, I would change it. I guess if you want to run the N3 (aka 10010) or F1 filters, which are larger, then maybe. But, since the filter is only $5-$6 at the dealer (depending on where you shop), it's cheap insurance.

I appreciate the information and the pic. I'm just thinking about protecting the engine at 5k instead of 10k with fresh oil. I figured if the filter is good for 10k why not let the dealer pickup that cost and effort while ensuring the oil isn't breaking down prematurely. It's pretty simple to drain and replace the oil. However, adding a simple step for the filter is pretty simple too.

 

[joseph777]

If the idea is to protect the engine at every 5,000 miles instead of 10,000 miles, then one should examine the oil filter. By this logic, if the oil is clogged enough by 5,000 miles with contaminants, soot, carbon buildup, debris, etc, then so is the oil filter since it’s the engine’s primary means of a filtrate. I bet if you cracked open the oil filter and had tools that could do mass spectrometer analysis, you’d probably find that 5,000 miles is about time regardless.

also the adage of changing the oil 5,000 instead of 10,000 miles is not because the oil is worn out- it’s because it was contaminated.

 

[Compherh]

Your first oil change will have the most metal in it. The engine being new will shave metal anywhere two parts touch each other and are in motion constantly (microscopic like powder). You can't see it in the oil with the naked eye. There are companies that analyze your oil and send you a report showing oil properties and metals detected. Your filter catches most of this stuff, not to mention the oil in the filter doesn't get changed out unless you replace the filter. For $6 it's a no brainer.

 

[CEtaco]

Your first oil change will have the most metal in it. The engine being new will shave metal anywhere two parts touch each other and are in motion constantly (microscopic like powder). You can't see it in the oil with the naked eye. There are companies that analyze your oil and send you a report showing oil properties and metals detected. Your filter catches most of this stuff, not to mention the oil in the filter doesn't get changed out unless you replace the filter. For $6 it's a no brainer.

I understand all of that. I am at 24k on my 2024 Limited. The next oil change is scheduled for 3/2026 or 28,500 miles.

 

[Pappy]

For $6 it's a no brainer.

Exactly. My dealer charges $4.11, so for me it's not even a question.

 

[HoptownBob]

I see a lot of people discussing the importance of changing the engine oil at 5000 mile intervals instead of 10k as suggested in the manual. I do understand and agree it can only help with longevity. However, is changing the filter really necessary every 5k if they are rated for 10k. Sure, the optimal thing is to change both the oil and the filter, but since the filters are rated at 10k, why not just change the oil and re-use the filter. It’s still fresh oil which can only help the engines longevity. What am I missing here?

If your using that logic with the filter then why not use it with the oil, it is rated for 10,000 miles also.

 

[Brent@ANParts]

I agree for your first oil change you should stick to 5k miles (personally I like to do 2500 on new stuff), but 10k or at least once a year should be fine. Oil tech has come a long way since the 3k mile interval days.

 

[Sagebrush]

However, is changing the filter really necessary every 5k if they are rated for 10k.

I suspect your engine would do just fine, but why not replace a $6 part while you're under there?

 

[CEtaco]

I totally agree with you Sagebrush!

 

[24tacoman]

5000km intervals for me. It’s a turbocharged engine and needs fresh oil more often because turbos are extremely hard on oil, especially in cold climates (massive heat cycles and temperature ranges). It won’t hurt anything doing it more often, and oil is cheap. Do the filter every time, the filter these come with is tiny and won’t hold as much debris as a larger one. Plus, they’re like $6 cad

 

[Franko Manini]

The only way to accurately determine if your oil is exhausted is through used oil analysis (UOA). Do some research and learn how to read a UOA report. You can use a vacuum pump to take a small sample at any interval you choose.

Given that the 2.4L iForce is both gasoline direct injection AND turbocharged, and the iForce-MAX add hybrid technology on top of that, your oil is more likely to be contaminated by fuel well before the additive package is consumed through high shear/high temperature (HSHT) conditions. The only exception to this might be someone how lives in a hot climate and/or drives mostly long trips (>30 minutes of continuous engine operation).

My recommendation regarding oil changes and sampling would be as follows:

1) 1000m (1600km) - Change oil and filter, no UOA. Rationale: There is no point in doing UOA for a break-in oil change since the oil will be contaminated by silicon (mostly from casting release agents and sealants) and your wear metals (iron, aluminum, copper, tin) will all be high due to break-in. Silicon is highly abrasive and will cause engine wear so your oil should be changed.

2) 3000m (5000km) - Change oil and filter and conduct UOA. Rationale: Silicon will still be present in large quantities and will have contaminated the oil and filter. UOA will establish a baseline for wear metal trending which should continue to reduce over the next 2-3 oil changes. UOA will also confirm if the oil is viable or not. likely it will retain significant viscosity (cStk @ 100 degrees C) but contaminants and wear metals will likely be high. This is also a good opportunity to be looking at % fuel dilution to see if your environment and driving habits are contributing to fuel dilution (fuel contamination in oil).

3) 6000m (9700km) - UOA, no oil or filter change. Rationale: This UOA will tell you how long your oil is likely to last given your driving habits (short trips vs long, towing, offroad use, cold environment, etc). A good lab will advise on when you should change your oil next given the trend for wear metals, fuel dilution, and HTHS (additive package) wear on the oil.

4) 8000m (13000km) - Change oil and filter and UOA. Rationale, The oil will now have 5000m or 8000km of use on it. Unless otherwise indicated, this is the longest interval I would recommend for a turbo, GDI, engine, and maybe even a bit long for a hybrid.

5) 13000m (21000km): Change oil and filter and UOA. Rationale: Unless otherwise indicated, this is the longest interval I would recommend for a turbo, GDI, engine, and maybe even a bit long for a hybrid. Again, your "mileage" WILL vary. Only UOA specific to your vehicle, driving habits (long vs short drives), use case (towing, off-road use), and environment (cold or warm climate) can accurately, determine when your oil needs replacement. By now, you should have noticed that wear metals have stabilized, and you should have a good idea how fuel dilution affects your engine (given the variables of driving habits, use case, and your environment).

6) 18000m (29000km): Change oil and filter, no UAO. Rationale: Regular 5000m (800km) oil and filter change for GDI and turbocharged engine. by now you should have really good trend data on your UOA reports, so you can likely switch to every other oil change for the analysis. some people (myself included) will conduct UAO for every oil change during the warranty period as it is perhaps the best early indication of a mechanical issue. providing a dealer with data that indicates an issue will be very helpful in resolving it under warranty.

This information is not my opinion. It's supported by good science and I share it with the group hoping everyone will gain a good understanding of how UOA can be helpful.

If you want to avoid the expense of UOA, then just change your oil every 5000m (8000km) or more frequently if you do a lot of short trips and seldom get the oil up to operating temperature (which, by the way is about 90 degrees C and takes a lot longer to reach than the coolant operating temperature). A simple sniff test can give you an idea if there is significant fuel in your oil. But I speculate that if you can smell it, it's probably already too high.

I drive a ton of short trips, so I am changing my oil and filter every 3000m (5000km), based on my UOA that shows significant fuel dilution, and viscosity (cStk @100C) is trending down from grade specification.

 

[TimC.]

Watch this nascar oil analysis expert explain how and why you should change the oil. I have a new TRD Sport and have just hit 3K miles on it and have changed the oil for the 3rd time based on oil analysis data. The break in period fills the oil up with wear metals and other containment. Be smart and let data drive your oil changes instead of tribal knowledge. My first oil change came at 360 miles to get my baseline. The results with the factory oil showed fuel delution elevated due to the rings wearing in. Also this caused the oil to not be in grade anymore. Wear metals Iron for example was also high. All of this is to be expected as the engine is new. NEVER EVER go 5k before you 1st oil change. Over time all these data point trend down which indicated the engine is fully broken in. Make sense?

 

[maxx075]

I work with a lot of people like you guys.

Always making things more complicated than they need to be.

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